B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

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B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
  STAR to me is the same as test only. TEST ONLY. Yes I bent the rules, so lets not go there. I bent the rules to help the consumer pure and simple.

  This is a bunch of sh**. The consumer can't find a place to get the car done because it has not run the monitors to complete. It's one short. The shops now walk out with a hand held scanner and check monitors.
Bull. TEST ONLY, test the car. Who is breaking the rules now? Who now cares more about themself than the consumer?

 Consumer affair, B.A.R. do your job. Look out for the consumer. The car would have passed, but no it will hurt my score. WHAT A BUNCH OF CRAP. The consumer took the time to go to the shop and then the tech lies? What is that about?

  BAR run undercover cars pul,l the STAR to those pre checking monitors, they are breaking the rules. I only bent them. Bent them to help the consumer, not for profit.


  Yes I'm pissed
007
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

007
Who cares if there car passes or fails? That is the problem with you bending the rules and with people who break the rules, I am still not sure that doing a partial inspection is breaking the rules, I asked this question before and no one could answer it for sure if partial inspections are still ok to do? and if not what page in the manuel says there not and what civil code backs it up. As a tech and a shop owner you only have one obilgation to the consumer, do a smog inspectin for what ever fee you choose to charge and the custimor can either choose to pay that price or go somewhere else. You are not obilagated to certify that vehicle by bending or breaking the rules. PERIOD! If you feel you owe the custimor a certificate then take the money out of your pocket and pay to fix it correctly, intentionly bending and breaking the rules shouldn't be an option.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

ufucwitdabest
In reply to this post by just another shop owner
The problem is that all the star people are scared of losing their star.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
In reply to this post by 007
You precheck monitors you are breaking the rules. There is no precheck. TEST ONLY. Test the f ing car not precheck the monitors. Pure clear rule TEST ONLY. Manuals my a** !Partial test NO, you are test only not check the monitors first. You wasted the consumer time for your own pocket.

 G3et off the bendig of the rules. You show me where it says all cars 2nd gear.
007
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

007
Show me in the manuel and a civil code that says partial inspections are not allowed. Pre test and partial inspection were allowed, unless they changed the law, if they did show me otherwise quit ranting about nothing.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
  What part of test only don't you understand? This is why this will fail. Pass or free retest will and has been the down fall of us. The whole point of this post was STAR stations are protecting the pocket screw the consumer.

  Show me in any code where I am to be held accountable for how I tested a car 2 yrs before. FPR
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

its easy
In reply to this post by just another shop owner
Under section 4.9 under STAR Q&A stations are allowed to prescreen for monitors.
Let me tell you why I do it, since 1/1/13 im the only STAR nearby and I get other shops that did not make STAR come here with cars with only the minimum set and pending codes, I had another tech tell me thats BS when I checked it first and was going to report me. I said ok here is the phone, first of all its not legal for you to sublet a smog, also its not legal to reset the codes without fixing it (his customer told me thats what they do normally) also they did not make STAR for high monitor deviations among other things,  So I said come on lets make a Bureau report right now and I will tell them why I refuse to do your car and you tell why you cleared codes with out fixing it , show me your repair invoice.  He literaly told me to stop when I was dialing the BAR number.

I do it on car dealers too, most not all, car dealers have a min wage mechanic that have a code scanner and reset codes, drive around untill the min set and try to smog without fixing, I have met several this month that tell that "their old smogger did not care but cant smoggem any more.

I do not prescreen walk up customers, some may have unset monitors most dont or have more than 2 and fail,
the walk up people will not get me deviated, only the dealers or repair people that try to pull fast ones, I will not play their game. The difference is that before they would drive around untill they found someone and now its harder




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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
 Ok so you can prescreen for monitors. News to me.

 My problem is rules. TEST ONLY STAR. Check the car, that was what Test Only was always about. How much clearer do you want.

 Test vehicle at this RPM tire speed should be X. Vehicle has, pvs , egr , air (pump) test cap with blue/ red/ brown Timing will be. All this crap should be on the computer.
This 90% bull.
NO you are test only pull it in and test it, hose off you don't care. Light on you don't care. You get paid pass or fail.

 The BAR was to lazy to update. 15 year old computer 14.4 modems. Books my a** it's all there on the screen.

 If we could bend the rule it was not a good rule to be judged by.

  Good people will go hungry because of the BAR and lazy ways.

 Perfect example is what this is all about. BAR gives you a rule. A car will pass with one unrun monitor. Then they nail you for following ther rule. They said it was OK to pass and then ding your score???????????
007
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

007
Just another shop, we do agree on one thing that the program is seriously flawed. But what I am saying is if you or anyone else make a statement make sure it is backed up by facts and state them, like the other poster told us where to find the correct information. There is so much mis information being posted anyone who would want to help fight this thing can not make any sense out of who to believe. I hope you are putting as much energy into contacting people who have the knoledge and power to change this thing as you do in posting here.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

Joeinpb
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
 Sorry 007 if you are fighting you have not read the writing on the wall. DAD will finish what is left of us nonSTAR. The volume and the BAR will close down the rest. End of March, June, July, all shops I know do killer. We did 60 to 70 a day those days. That is when the State will run under cover. The State does not want us.

 The Serria group report will see to that.

 I just burns my ass we got blamed for the BAR being lazy. Hard, set fast rules. Rules you can go to the book on. Partial preinspection my rear, TEST ONLY Charge every time.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

Accused
Simple rules (maybe).

1.  Conduct the ASM test in 2nd gear. Only select first gear or third gear when it's necessary to maintain the EIS specified RPM range. - says it on the screen, says it in the book.  If you deviated from that procedure, you did it WRONG.  What favor did you do for the public by altering that procedure in order to incorrectly pass the vehicle.  Do the test right and fail the car if it fails the inspection.  You aren't helping anyone by incorrectly passing vehicles anymore than if you were incorrectly failing vehicles.  The ONLY gray area on this pertains more to vehicles that MIGHT be possible to keep in 2nd gear if you can hit a very small rpm window like 2990 rpm at 24.1 mph or 1510 rpm at 15.9 mph.  

2. Pre-inspection rejection is not covered by any manual in any way by what I have read.  However, contract law would mean that once you have given an estimate for a smog inspection, you are under contract to perform THAT service.  BAR has put out notices by way of BAR blasts, newsletter and online postings that state that it is their determination that pre-inspection rejections for incomplete monitors are acceptable to them.  It is still required that you contract specifically for that service and estimates are still required.  
007
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

007
You can pre inspect and reject any vehicle for any reason you choose. A few years back there was a shop in Fresno that would reject vehilces for all kinds of reasons. The BAR told them they couldn't do that and tried to site them. Guess what, there attorney asked them to show them the law that said they couldn't do that and guess what, they could not produce one, so the attorney said fuck you very much and sitation dropped. That same shop is still rejecting cars today. That is why, I asked if they have changed that law and if they did can anyone tell me where to find it.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
Do the test in 2nd gear. Dare you to on a nissan pickup.

  Get it people we were graded on 90% It meant the rules were flawed.

 Why do you guys stand up for the BAR, do you work for them. We got screwed by them.


   CLEAR STRAIGHT NO BENDING RULES simple
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

Accused
You are not bending the rules when you follow them exactly.  The Nissan you are referring to has to be shifted when you follow the rules.  Why is this so hard for you to understand?

If RPM is outside the prescribed range when the wheel speed is within the prescribed range you are REQUIRED to shift.
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

just another shop owner
 Accused don't you get it? Why does a Nissan pickup get a better chance at passing. High RPM = heat , heat= pass. 90% is not exact rules. 100% is perfect rules. I bent the rules by using the window given to me.

 You don't get, it I do, we bent the rules. The BAR can't be wrong so you don't get your STAR.

    STAR, get it you were a good little boy, you got your gold Star. Fu**ing children get Gold STARS. Prove to the BAR they can be beat and Oh bad boy you don't get your STAR, Well wait till this summer when you get that STAR  up where the sun don't shine.    
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Re: B.S. Pure and simple B.S.

Accused
I get it.  The rule is the rule.  I care less about BAR and more about if I test the car and it goes down the street that we both do the test the same way.  Or that if the vehicle fails and comes back for a retest that the second test is performed the same as the first.  

BAR is not wrong that there is too much variation in this testing procedure - they are just wrong about how they have set about monitoring and punishing for it.  For example, if you test every vehicle in overdrive, the system never recognizes that as a deviation.   Same thing if you shift every manual trans to 3rd gear for the 25mph.  It is only recognizing rpm that EXCEEDS their criteria (300 rpm above the 90th percentile for the vehicle group).

I just want to see you acknowledge that the rule is the rule.  There really is no bending it. You either followed it or you didn't.

And as for your assertion that high rpm = heat = pass.  Wrong again. The reason that vehicles clean up when you get the rpm high in most cases is because you are overcoming load through power band and reducing effective combustion heat.  Load = Heat = high NO in many cases.

But you are right, 90% is not rules it is consensus.  And like in the climate change debate, consensus is what they want to fall back on because they can't define it through rule (or real science).